Our Guest Art Thomas
JAMIE: And yet I see a connection between forgiveness and healing.
ART: Hmm.
JAMIE: Have you noticed this?
ART: Yeah. I haven’t looked into that verse you’re mentioning but I would say that it definitely takes faith to forgive.
JAMIE: Yeah.
ART: I mean Jesus said in John 15:5 apart from Me you can do nothing. So that’s pretty inclusive, right? [laughs]
JAMIE: Right. Totally.
ART: My understanding of forgiveness – you know I was abused as a kid. Not by my parents, they’re awesome people but you know older boys in my neighborhood and just went through some stuff and it wasn’t till I was 17 years old that forgiveness clicked. And I realized like my idea of forgiveness until then had been uh, sweep it under the rug! No big deal. We’ll pretend it didn’t happen!
JAMIE: Ahh. Yeah.
ART: God’s idea of forgiveness is what you did was wrong. A price must be paid. I’ll pay it!
JAMIE: Wow!
ART: And then He does!
JAMIE: He does.
ART: And so for us now forgiveness is what these people did to me was wrong. A price must be paid. Jesus paid it and I trust that that sacrifice is enough! To say anything different, to say I wish that person would pay is to look at Jesus on the cross and say what You did was insufficient!
JAMIE: Mmm.
ART: So when it – you know how that relates to healing and everything I mean I’ve seen people healed when they forgive. The danger we run into is when people start using those anecdotes and saying well maybe the reason you’re not healed is you haven’t forgiven.
JAMIE: Mmm!
ART: And we start piling you know condemnation on people and we’re like you’re better. I’m not better. I don’t know who. Nobody ever did anything to me. Like –
JAMIE: Right. Right.
ART: Tell me what I’m not forgiving. I’ll forgive. Please.
JAMIE: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah!
ART: And so I’m of the mindset like okay Jesus never had someone come to him for healing and He’s like I’m sorry until you forgive your uncle for what he did I’m not going to do it, right?
JAMIE: Ahh!
ART: However I’ve seen like I said healing happen in the context of forgiveness so what do you do? Like in James 5 it says the prayer of faith will make the sick person well. The Lord will raise him up. If he’s sinned he’ll be forgiven.
JAMIE: Hmm!
ART: And then after that it says therefore confess your sins one to another that you may be healed. So which one is it? Is it you know minister healing and forgiveness is received instantaneously or is it receive forgiveness and then after that you get healed? I like to say the answer is yes!
JAMIE: Right!
ART: The blood of Jesus is messy.
JAMIE: Yeah.
ART: You get a little on you for one thing it’s there for the rest. Right?
JAMIE: Yeah.
ART: As we’re forgiving others we are coming in contact and agreement with the sacrifice Jesus made saying Your work is enough so it’s all about trusting Jesus. The whole thing.
JAMIE: Wow. Yeah, it’s the “what came first, the chicken or the egg” kind of scenario.
ART: [laughs] Yeah.
Tags: its supernatural, Sid Roth