SID: Welcome. Welcome to my world where it’s naturally supernatural. My guest was so stuck because of past hurts, trauma, pain, her marriage, her family, unbearable. But she got supernaturally unstuck and she says she knows how to not only get you unstuck, but when you get unstuck, your marriages will be the way God determined them to be, your relationship with your children will be unstuck and your relationship with God will be unstuck. So Trisha, did you agree that your husband, who is now in Heaven, Jack Frost, was an amazing combination. He was one of the most adventurous humans on Earth, but he was also one of the most wounded humans on Earth. That’s quite a package. And he went to a conference. Your marriage was like most of your marriages, kind of good one day, bad another day. You know what I’m talking about. And he went to a conference, and it totally changed him. In fact, Jack was such an adventurous person, let’s go to a clip from the last time I interviewed him on television.
JACK FROST: Father God comes into my closet and takes me in his arms, and helps me. And for 45 minutes—
SID: Excuse me, Jack, I’m hearing what you’re saying. What do you mean God helped you? What does that mean?
JACK FROST: God helped me and I had such a need of comfort. I had never felt comforted. I was 44 years old and consumed with fear.
SID: Are you telling me that you felt like I just felt, that God did that?
JACK FROST: Yes. I could feel the arms of God around me.
SID: I tell you, I told you he was adventurous. But I have to tell you, Trisha, I’m still not comfortable with a man jumping in my lap. How tall was he?
SID: 6-5. How would like a 6-5 man to jump in your lap? But now, Jack’s parents were alcoholics. He was almost a tyrant at home. Is that fair?
TRISHA: Pretty much, yeah, pretty much.
SID: Okay. Your background. Now you were raised in a very Christian family, but very legalistic.
SID: And your father had a, what was it, a heart attack at a young age, and you went from middle class to barely getting by.
SID: What is it about us humans that whatever our father is like, that’s what we attribute God to? What causes that?
TRISHA: Well I think it’s the first relationship with a male figure in our life. You know, it’s our earthly father and it’s out of that relationship that we learn how to be comfortable in the presence of love. And if we don’t have that, you know, that love, you know, expressed to us, you know, in ways that nurture us, you know, that cause us to want to live, that cause us to be affirmed and feel comfortable, you know if our basic needs aren’t taken care of in this relationship, it kind of helps us, or really it really makes us see Father God in the same light that we see our earthly [unintelligible].
SID: So you know, she gets married like everyone, and what is the image of a marriage? Not your parents. The image of a marriage is Hollywood. So it wasn’t Hollywood, was it.
TRISHA: No it wasn’t. Because Jack grew up in a very wounded home with wounded parents and they didn’t know how to get, they did not know how to meet his needs. You know, we all have needs of love, affirmation, security and purpose. And Jack’s family only provided those conditions if Jack was performing. You know, if he was being the best kid or if he was the best tennis player, or if he was living life doing everything that made his parents look good. And so Jack was kind of, you know, he wasn’t rebellious or whatever, but he just never felt valued just because he was a guy, just because he was a kid, you know, he never had that place of security. Like when Jack jumped in your lap, it might have made…you felt uncomfortable.
SID: It did.
TRISHA: But Jack was very comfortable at that time in his life. He was very comfortable with the presence of a father.
SID: Okay. Both of you, we might say, were love starved.
SID: And you were literally each sucking the life out each other because you were so love starved. Is that unusual?
TRISHA: I think that it’s very usual. I get to travel all over the world and everywhere I go, I see marriages in the same shape. Some marriages were in worse shape than ours because so many people were wounded. And here’s a great statistic I learned not too long ago. Eighty percent of kids under the age of 18 years old today are living in homes where the birth father is not there. So can you imagine what’s going on in that home, you know? Whenever they’re put in a home or an environment to where there’s no environment created for them to feel value, for them to feel like, okay, somebody is proud of me. Somebody sees what’s inside of me and they want me to have a purpose, and they want to affirm me. Where I travel, that’s most places. That’s most homes that I see. I mean, over 80 percent. That’s unheard of.
SID: When Jack went to a conference, he comes home and he does something, well he repents. Candidly, because I know you’re a transparent person.
SID: When he came home, he went out a tyrant. He comes home. He apologizes for his actions. What did you think initially?
TRISHA: I was suspicious. You know, I mean, I had seen Jack say I’m sorry, you know, before, but his “I’m sorry” was “I’m sorry, but if you hadn’t had done this I wouldn’t have behaved that way.” Or “I’m sorry for this, but…” You know, there always was an excuse attached to his repentance.
SID: A justification.
TRISHA: Right, a justification. Why he did what he did. This time he comes in and there’s, his demeanor is different. There’s a gentleness, you know, there’s not a hardness, you know. And so I’m suspicious. I’m like, okay, this is going to change any minute. But then he comes in and he humbles himself, and he takes ownership. See, Jack had never done that. It was always, “I’m sorry, but if you did not do…” This time it was, “I’m sorry, Trisha, I realize that I have hurt and wounded you.”
SID: Hold that thought.
SID: I want to find out exactly what he said, because it transformed him. I want to find out what happened to him. What transformed him, because once he was transformed, Trisha was transformed. When she was transformed, their family was transformed. Be right back.
Sid RothComments Off on Our Guests Rolland & Heidi Baker
Sid: My guest is red hot for the Messiah. I have on the telephone Heidi Baker from Mozambique, Africa. Yesterday you got a chance to meet her husband Rolland. And they have a ministry that has started some 5000 churches. They feed over 2000 orphans daily. Their ministry has seen some 17 people raised from the dead, every miracle that you can imagine that you can read about in the Bible that some say “I wonder if it was true?” You ought to go to Mozambique and you’ll see that every miracle in the Bible not only is true but it’s happening there today. Now Heidi, it doesn’t sound like you would be living the life you’re living being raised in southern California in a privileged community. It seems to me that we here in the west we’re with the creature comforts that we have if all of a sudden the United States of America would become a third world country even believers couldn’t take it. How do you take living the type of life you live in Africa compared to the way you started.
Heidi: Oh, I just… I love it, I love being where people are hungry for Jesus! I love being where people want Him. So for me my greatest challenge is coming to the western world.
Heidi: (Laughing) Because their less hungry, their less hungry for Him so often because they have so much stuff. The emphasis on stuff that it’s hard for them to be desperate and dying and running into the arms of God.
Sid: I mean we have more Bibles per square Christian than anyone in history, we have Christian television, Christian radio, Christian books, Christian cassettes, Christian music. We have almost everything is done for us, churches where it’s mostly entertainment sport and whoever’s got the best show in town that’s where we go. But most people spend their whole life just being fed, just getting fat.
Heidi: Well “Blessed are the poor in spirit for there’s is the Kingdom of heaven.” This is actual reality, those who are desperate and dying and hungry. They can be rich we’re not… just because we’re rich doesn’t mean we cannot get poor in spirit. We can if God does a supernatural work in our heart even amongst all of this stuff we can be desperate for Him. But what we see among the poor is this need, they know that they’re in need. They’re opposite of well fed, their opposite of proud, they’re humbled, they’re broken, they’re poured out. They’re desperate saying “God unless You do something I will die. Unless You do something I will die.” No hospital, no ambulance, nowhere to run to but Jesus and unless He comes and heals them they’re dead. And the Kingdom breaks forth for these people. So I just think that God has blessed us and given us poor and the children to teach us about His Kingdom.
Sid: Now, I’m sure you’re familiar with the scriptures that talk about the poor. In Isaiah I was reading this just this morning and I know that it’s probably a very important scripture in your life. But in Isaiah 50…
Sid: Yes, I’m turning to it right now, let me read this and it talks about fasting and a lot of Christians want to fast because they feel that they can get closer to God. But more importantly God will answer their prayer. But God says “This is the fast that I want.” And He says and picking up in the last part of the 7th verse. “Share your bread with the hungry, and that you bring to your house the poor who are cast out, who are wandering, when you see the naked that you cover him; and not hide yourself from your own flesh. Then your light shall break forth like the morning. Then your healing shall speed forth speedily.” You know everyone is looking for keys to healing. I mean here in the west you go into the church there’s as many people sick as outside of the church. I really believe if you really wanted to state the missing key Heidi this is it. What would you say?
Heidi: Yeah absolutely it’s so clear it’s amazing because we were reading this talking on this very verse this morning so this is exciting to me. What kind of fasting are we to do? It’s to care, it’s to see. It’s to have eyes that are open and to stop for the dying and the hurting and the broken. And people wonder they talk about renewal dying and revival dying and it doesn’t die if we care. You know we say that there’s always enough but enough for what? Enough for the dying, enough for the broken and enough for the poor and if it’s just you and your family of four then you’ll be satisfied with a tiny bit with a little or you’ll just become fat. But God is saying “No, care, see, have a heart that is open and broken. Don’t turn the channel when you see dying and brokenness, but love like Jesus loves and care like He cares.” It’s true Christianity.
Sid: You know I promised the Mishpochah about how you and Rowland met but it goes back even before then. It goes back when you were in the 6th grade you had a teacher that had a major impact on your life. Tell me about her.
Heidi: Yes, I was just sitting there I loved God but didn’t know how to be born again and she suddenly, she had just come back from China and she put up these pictures of these dying old ladies in Hong Kong that lived in cages the poorest of the poor. And I said “God I want to help those ladies, I want to do something.” And I learned how to count in Chinese I said “Someday I’m going to go and I’m going to help those poor people, those hurting people.” And she talked about what God did and about miracles and about the poor. It was so amazing because years later I was working in the slums in Mexico City during a university break taking teams there. I was arrested, thrown in jail for preaching. And I’m there and I’m praying in church one day and the Lord spoke to me and said “One day you’re going to marry Rowland Baker.” And I was like “What?” I had never been on a date with Rowland Baker. So I got back from Mexico City, I didn’t tell Rowland but he came to my office in the university and we began to talk and pray together. Went out to lunch once, I was worshiping Jesus my hands were lifted up, I was worshiping and worshiping the Lord and the Lord said “Tonight he’s going to ask you to marry him.” And it was time for curfew I had to be back in my dorm and just then he asked me to marry him and we got married after 1 date. We got married and he said to me one day just before we were married that his parents were ready to go back to China. So we were going to meet them and showed up at this little church and said “This is my mother Mrs. Baker.” And I said “Mrs. Baker” and she said “Heidi.” And it turned out that his mother was my six grade school teacher.
Sid: (Laughing) Now tell me God didn’t have His hand on the two of you getting together. That is such a wonderful story. But you did a teaching that I saw on the Sermon on the Mount that I have… I’ll tell you what you used a phrased “You got ruined.” God ruined you.
Sid: You ruined me Heidi. I saw real Christianity. I heard real Christianity, I don’t care for the religious stuff anymore, it doesn’t have any interest to me. If you would teach the balance of this week what God has shown you on the Sermon of the Mount. I really want our Mishpochah to understand this.
Heidi: Bless your heart. Well it’s from the beatitudes Matthew 5 and really the children and the poor have taught me how to understand this. And they have taught me more about God and more about His presence and more about His love than any well-known speaker I have ever met. And so if it’s okay with you I’d like to just share their stories because their stories have taught me about the beatitudes and what it means to really love.
Sid: Hey, guess what? We are right in the center of God’s will right now. His Spirit is starting to pour out and you can start I don’t know how far we’ll get today but please start and tell their stories.
Heidi: Well I began with “Blessed are the poor in spirit because there’s is the kingdom of heaven.” We were ministering doing dance, dramas around the world and seeing 1000’s of people coming to the Lord every night. And one day the Lord really spoke to both Rowland and me and just spoke to us and said “Stop, stop what you’re doing.” And your first reaction is to say “Get behind me Satan.” I mean why would God tell you to stop doing these crusades, these huge meetings. And He did He said “Stop, I want you to sit with the poor, I want you to sit with the broken.” And he sat us in Hong Kong, we moved into the slums and we sat with the poor and they taught us about the kingdom of heaven. They taught us about what it means to really love and what it means to really be desperate and hungry and really need God. And for 20 years we’d been sitting with the poor just learning about the kingdom of heaven breaking forth for the poor, breaking forth for the desperate, breaking for the humble. And it says “Blessed are those who mourn because they shall be comforted.” There’s this little girl when I look at this I always think of her. Her names Constancia, she was the saddest little girl I’ve ever seen in my life. She broken and dying, she’d been raped, she’d been beaten, she was abandoned on the bakery stairs in Shahongo in Mozambique where we…
Sid: Heidi, we’re out of time. We’ll pick up right here on tomorrow Mishpochah.
Sid: You know Mishpochah about a month or so ago I went to a one week seminar on understanding the source of diseases and how to get rid of them. It was by Henry Wright and there were a number of things that I’m still pondering a great deal today. Because I’ve been searching to understand healing for as long as I’ve been a believer over 30 years now and for us there not supposed to be mysteries but there are still some mysteries in reference to healing. And God has put within Henry Wright some teaching that I’ve in all these years I’ve never seen before. He has found that every disease about 80% of the time has a common origin and when you can get that common origin you can get rid of the disease. But I have to tell you, and I have him on the telephone right now; Henry I have to tell you there’s one thing that blessed me so much and it had nothing to do with your seminar. You know what that was?
Henry: What was that?
Sid: That was going to your church service.
Sid: Because you’re doing something that I’ve been just preaching about. What you are doing is what I believe the church is supposed to be. It’s not supposed to be a one man show except if you call that Man the Son of God. It’s supposed to be a God experience where each person contributes but most pastors are afraid and that’s the word to do. What he does Mishpochah, is he has wonderful worship going on that is then as the Holy Spirit interrupts, so to speak, there’s an open microphone and he actually has people sit in the front couple of rows with a different color card. One card represents a testimony, another one represents perhaps a teaching, or a psalm, or a hymn. But Henry, I mean I can see doing this in a little house meeting, but how do you get away with it with a congregation the size of yours?
Henry: Well, you have to teach the body how to flow together and we feel clearly in a particular time setting of the service that the Holy Spirit can prompt individuals to bring forth information, testimonies, prophecies, doctrine revelation that would paint a tremendous picture and at a given time period. Almost the same thing as when you read in the New Testament it says the prophet gets up and he begins to prophecy. Another prophet sitting by has a more advance revelation and he stands up. The first prophet sets down and the second prophet continues to expound the Holy Spirit at truth God wants the body to hear. Third prophet standing by, or sitting by, hears something additional from God and he stands up thinking that one sits down showing clearly that God can speak in a corporate setting through His people. I’ve always been intrigued by that and I truly felt that if we could understand lst Corinthians 14 clearly “When you come together all of you have a psalm, have a doctrine, have a revelation, have a tongue, have a interpretation. But all things have to be done unto edifying that God would orchestrate that the whole church does not end up doing it but in a service powerful things happen.”
Sid: Well what do you do when because it is an open microphone someone you don’t know gets and shares something that’s off the wall? What do you do?
Henry: Well, that’s a really exciting thing when that happens.
Sid: Oi vey! That’s not what most pastors would say okay.
Henry: I mean there has to be a place of safety in our churches and a lot of pastors are so afraid that somebody might get up and say something wrong, that somebody might be offended and they would leave and…
Sid: And there goes the tithe. (Laughing)
Henry: There goes the tithe; there goes the growth of the church. I’ve had it happen because when you open up the Body not only does the Holy Spirit show up but the kingdom sometimes shows up. Or people as I said I think the prophet Jeremiah said that “There are those that even prophesy out of their own spirits. And so as as… but the Bible says that we’re to set back and judge all things. I mean we’re going to judge angels one day why can’t we judge true doctrine and truth. And so it happened last year a theologian actually came in and he had this little thing going and he actually got up and oh my it was really not very good. And so I got up and I said “Well, that’s interesting and I really see why you came to that conclusion but let’s just go to the word and begin to look at the full parameter of the truth.” And I began to reveal this and that and harmony here and there. We had a Bible study right on the spot so that the sheep could learn and be safe and to be convinced in their own hearts.
Sid: I have to share one other thing real quickly Mishpochah, when I was there it was the most phenomenal God thing because the first night there are a lot of people sitting before the first session so my wife and I went to the one week seminar and we sat down, just at random, so we thought. And it turned out that there was a woman that said she was there because she had I believe chronic fatigue syndrome. And for years she’s just been confined to limited activity. And her husband said that he was there to support his wife. And then we find out that she was Baptist and he’s Jewish and he’s not a believer in the Messiah. Before the week was over this man publically proclaimed Jesus as his Messiah, before the week was over this man was filled with the Holy Spirit. Before the week was over this man was water baptized, before the week was over at that church service I was talking about Henry…
Sid: Both of them got up and they both got what they wanted. She got up and said “Well, I really came so that my husband could get saved.” He got up and said “I really came so my wife could get healed.” And they both got what they prayed for. Anyway our times slipping away Henry; there is a subject and this is the thing that I walked away with from your seminar. I’ve been a believer over 30 years and there is a keen understanding of the spirit world, a keener understanding I left with than before I came. And let’s face it out battle isn’t flesh and blood and we have to understand. And there was a teaching that you gave called “Separation” that I just wish everyone in the world could understand. Perhaps right now you’ll start teaching about I feel the fundamental teaching that you make available and this alone in my opinion is enough for someone to get from where they’re stuck to that next point. Please explain what you mean by separation.
Henry: Well, I agree it’s probably astounding to those that would listen this week to this program the understanding of the invisible kingdom ruled by Satan and what it really is and what it is and where it is and how it’s operating. I know that I taught in a world class missions organization about a year ago and of all the teachings that I did in that week the leadership came to me and said “This is the most incredible teaching they’d heard in the history of them being believers. Because it answered so many questions about the warfare, you know you quoted the scripture in part that says “Our war our battle is not against flesh and blood, but against principalities and powers and spiritual wickedness in high places and the rulers of the darkness of this world.” My battle is not with the person that has just victimized me with just rage and anger. My battle is with the rage and anger that’s manifesting through that person that they allow. My battle is not with my own self-hatred, for example if I had it which thank God I’ve been delivered. But my battle is not with my own fears my battle is not with myself, but what is within me that’s manifesting that I have become one with. Classically in order to forgive others and to be able to… a lot of people ask me “How do you forgive somebody?” I mean look what they did to me. That teaching on separation helps to understand and we’ll get into this later in our discussion on separation. But as Paul said “I want to do good, but I don’t do it and the day that I do this evil it no longer I that do it, that sin that dwells in me.” What do you mean if he let fear manifest through him, if he allowed guilt and rage or anger or pride to manifest through him wouldn’t that be him doing it. Wouldn’t that just be his psychology, wouldn’t that just be maybe he just needed inner healing. No he said “No it wasn’t even him doing it.” When I read that a few years ago I said “Oh, my goodness gracious that wasn’t his psychology, it wasn’t even him.” Now God what did Paul mean? And that led me down a journey of study from the book of Genesis all the way through and boy did I understand the second heavens.
Sid: You know just to digress a little bit because we’ll really get into the teaching tomorrow we’ll start it. One of my pet peeves is it appears more valuable time is spent on Christian television shows selling vitamins than talking about how to get healed based on what Jesus did for us. It seems as though more is done based on Christian psychology than understanding this concept of spirit, soul and body and separation that you teach. Why is that Henry?
Henry: Well, you know we’ve bought a false security. Many of the teachings of the mainline Christianity said that when you’re born again you accept for being oppressed or depressed, that you’re immune to a kingdom its external and you no longer have to worry about anything from the kingdom of Satan and that kingdom is out of Ephesians chapter 6 we just referenced. I found that Jesus didn’t teach that, Paul didn’t teach that and then almost over 20 years of ministry on my end I have discovered that it is not without but it’s with access to the spiritual level within.
Sid: I hate to do but we’re out of time Mishpochah but it promises to be a very life changing life for you.
Sid: My guest is Peggy Joyce Ruth, I’m speaking to her at her home in Brownwood, Texas. She’s just written a new book called “Psalm 91 for Children.” If there has ever been a time because you see Peggy Joyce I believe the next move of God’s Spirit is going to be young people.
Peggy Joyce: Oh yes.
Sid: And where this is “Psalm 91 for Children” we know as a fact that you can go all the way down to just a young child, teenagers, adults, everyone has this need. And by the way that you have presented it I believe it would appeal to all people. But just a couple of days ago you had a occasion to see if Psalm 91 worked in your life it got hot at your house what happened?
Peggy Joyce: Yes it did, the enemy is always going to try. He’s going to come just because we believe the word of God that doesn’t mean that we’re never going to have a challenge. And I have a wonderful example. The day before yesterday my husband had just left for work and he decided to come back and get some wood to bring into the house for me. And when he came in I said “Jack there’s smoke in the house.” So we both went up the stairs and he found that one of the walls of the ceiling was really hot. And when he started to pull it back a little bit all of a sudden the flames were just engulfed in the attic. And immediately you mind just says “Oh no, what’s wrong?”
Sid: It’s supposed to happen in movies not in real life.
Peggy Joyce: I know exactly. You know it was kind of like I was thinking you know if this can’t be happening. And it was just like God just spoke up in my spirit and said “You been trained, you know what to do; this is your time to stand on your covenant.” And so we started confessing our covenant” and I’ve told in one of my books how the Lord had told us to put a fire hose I mean garden hose in our out hot water heater closet and Jack did that 25 years ago. And we took that water hose and Jack started holding the water hose on it. And I call 911 and when they got out here the fire chief looked, Jack had already had the fire out. And he looked up there and he said “There’s been a fire going slowly for hours and he said “I can count on one hand how many houses had a fire in the attic that had already gone full blaze that we were able to save. And he said “This…” and he said “This is miraculous.” And so anyway we were just rejoicing because there’s not just one bit of smoke damage. Any time you have a fire there’s going to be smoke damage on the ceiling and the walls. We don’t have any smoke damage, we don’t have any water damage. Jack put so much water up there on it. It did not even come down and even…
Sid: So in the natural you should have come to your home and it should have been gone.
Peggy Joyce: Well, that’s exactly what the fire chief told us; he told us about 3 different times that “Do you realize what has happened here?” He said “Your house should not be standing right now.” He said “You should not even have a house left.” And you know we could tell by looking at the 2 by 4s when it was over with that fire had been burning for a good while. There were 2 or 3 of them that had burned all the way in two. And yet there is no smoke damage, there is no water damage anywhere. We had this one little area there that we’re going to have to replace about three or four 2 by 4’s. And the fire chief just went away just shaking his head just saying this is wonderful.
Sid: You know Mishpochah, Peggy Joyce has studied Psalm 91 for 25 years and has one miracle after another, after another. And on yesterday’s broadcast you said something pretty interesting. You said “There are four major categories of what can happen to someone and they’re all covered in Psalm 91.” Everything, every problem that a human could face is covered in Psalm 91. Would you tell me what those 4 categories are?
Peggy Joyce: Yes, in verses 5 and 6 it says “You will not be afraid of the terror by night, you’ll not be afraid of the arrows that fly by day, the pestilence that stalks in darkness and the destruction that lays waste.” Okay under those 4 categories:
The terror by night – That’s any evil that can come through another person.
The arrows that fly by day – That’s the assignments of the enemy. That’s where we use our spiritual warfare.
The Pestilence – Every fatal epidemic that… and of course we look at cancer and all of the fatal diseases that are hitting the masses. And then…
Destruction – Is the evil that’s outside of man’s control like what the world would call natural disasters.
Sid: In my burden in particular is young people, you were telling me before we went on the air of what’s going on with young people today, explain.
Peggy Joyce: Well, there’s so much fear, you know that we don’t think about children being so fearful but we know one little girl that she pulls out her little eyelashes when she gets anxious. We have one little guy he was constantly wringing his hands when he’d get fearful because he kept thinking having these fear pictures that is mom and dad would get killed in a car accident. And we’re constantly getting calls from parents and they can’t understand why their child has nightmares. And I just truly believe that because so much of this is covered in just a real simple child like way that this can be one of the greatest gifts that a child can be given to equip him.
Sid: Listen, I can’t wait to get this to my granddaughters. How young would you consider reading this to them?
Peggy Joyce: Well an 8 or 9 year old can read it for themselves on up clear through adult. But 4, 5, 6 we’ve tried this out on really young children and it is amazing how well they can comprehend when it is read to them.
Sid: You talk about one of my favorite subjects in your book, angels.
Peggy Joyce: Yes.
Sid: Tell me a story about angels.
Peggy Joyce: What’s exciting about this is that angels are covered in Psalm 91; the authority of the believer is covered. Every verse I take that verse and make a chapter out of it and then of course at the end there’s 7 more additional promises to the one who truly loves God. And so anything, any way that God can protect its covered in Psalm 91. And so we… our little grandson he was 5 years old at the time was swimming with his cousins in the pool and they had a friend over, a little guy named James he was older than Collin. But Collin’s a big boy he’s 8 years old now and he weighed 140 pounds so he’s a big little guy. And James is a very small guy he’s just real slender and the adults had called the kids into the house. And so everyone had gotten out of the pool and the only ones the last ones to go in were James and Collin. And so Collin stepped off the side of the pool he said “James, watch this.” And he stepped off of the side of the pool on to a rubber raft and he stepped onto it like it’d be a solid piece and what it did was slipped out from under him and he fell backwards into the water grazing his head on the side of the pool when he fell and it was in the deep end and so James watched him because it must have addled him because his little arms and legs were just out stretching he was just sinking to the bottom. So James dived in and said all he could think about was that Collin was twice as big as he was and he didn’t know how on this earth he was going to get him out. And so he said that he just started crying out and he said “God you got to help me.” And he went down and put his arms under Collin’s armpits and suddenly it just felt like somebody grabbed him from behind and started pushing both he and Collins straight up from the bottom of the pool. And he thought that one of the adults had seen them and had dived in to help. And he said that “They literally shot up of the water with Collin above him.” And then he said “It was like somebody pulled Collin from his arms and just laid him up on the side of the pool.” Now keep in mind that there in the deep end of the pool and there wasn’t any way it was way over his head so there was no way for him to touch the bottom and to kick off and sure no way to lift dead weight you know out of the pool. And he said “It was like they shot out of the water and the next thing he knew he had Collin laying on the side.” And he looked around and fully expecting one of the adults that had pulled them out of there and there was nobody there, absolutely no one. And he said “He knew that God had just heard his call and sent an angel to help because they went back into the water later and he tried to you know to kick off of the bottom. And he tried to get up enough strength you know to lift Collin out of the water and he said “There was no way, that he couldn’t even think about jumping himself out that way much less picking a child that’s double his weight and laying him up on the bank down in the 8 foot water.”
Sid: You know one of the things that I love about your book is first you teach and I’ll tell you something Mishpochah Peggy Joyce is not only a teacher but after investing 25 years in Psalm 91. So first she teaches and then she has examples and you not only have illustrations but you have photographs of the people that you’re talking about in the back of the book.
Peggy Joyce: Yes, children love to be able to put a face with the pictures so they’ve loved that to be able to go back to the back of the book and find the picture of the person that the story’s about and then they’ll see under the picture see the story on page so and so. And then they can go back and they’ve got a picture and it just makes it really come alive for them.
Sid: Tell me about the tornado.
Peggy Joyce: Oh, one night when the kids were still at home we turned on our radio just as they reported that there was a tornado on the ground south of the country club. And of course that’s where we live. Well the sky it was a strange color and everything was still and there wasn’t a night creature making a sound. And there was so much electricity in the air that your hair just felt like it was standing on end. So most people would have been hiding their children which Jack goes in and gets the kids up and tells them to get their Bibles and get outside. And we had the kids outside and he had them circling the house with us and we were reading Psalm 91 and speaking directly to that tornado to be gone in Jesus name. We did that for a good while and then all of a sudden we felt peaceful again and by that time everything had changed and the water was just coming down in bucketfuls it felt like. And when we walked back into the house the radio announcer was saying these were the exact words because we wrote them down at the time “This is nothing short of a miracle the funnel cloud south of the country club has suddenly lifted back into the sky.”
Sid: Listen, that’s not abnormal teach us… I can’t wait to get this to my granddaughters.